eminiviper.com

I started this topic because some questions I asked and answers I got from cba33558 were getting lost in this rather extensive topic here:

http://www.mypivots.com/forum/topic.asp?TOPIC_ID=2300&whichpage=30

We started this discussion on page 30 of that thread, and I thought I'd move it here so we can continue it (since no one took me up on my offer to start this thread). I'll cut and paste the three posts made after cba33558 posted a chart about eminiviper.com

From 6/8/09:

jimkane: Hey, cba. I checked out that EminiViper.com page. Very impressive. Seems like they don't have any losing days, or even losing trades (or do they not post those?). Is that so? If not, how many stop outs or false signals are you seeing on an average day? It doesn't mean much to me to see winners, I am more interested in the losers I have to take to get those winners. Also, are you the owner of EminiViper.com, or do you work for them? If not, what is your association? If I don't ask, that will likely be the first question from everyone else. Thanks.


cba33558: Hey Jim -

Thanks for visiting the Web site and offering your constructive questions and feedback...

The videos are intended to show the NQ Emini trades that are triggered by the system each day. Currently the system is designed to issue trade signals only the Nasdaq Emini. In addition to the Viper indicator, the system uses a combination of guidance charts and a trading chart that very rarely has a losing trade. With all of these constraints, it should be noted however, that there are not many signals that trigger in any given trading day. Depending on the volatility - usually one or two trades may trigger - a busy day would be 3 trades.

The entire trading system is not shown in the videos; however, all of the details regarding these trade signals are shown in an eBook and training videos. The actual trade signals themselves are analyzed in real-time in the live Webinars. The entire goal of this system was accuracy - not catching every trade.

In answer to your other question, I have been a trader for a little over 12 years now, I am a partner in the firm; and was involved extensively in developing, actively trading and back-testing the Viper system over the past year and a half.

Once again, thank you for your input, and I look forward to opportunity of respectfully participating in your Forum...


jimkane: Thanks for the response, cba. Wow, those are some incredibly impressive stats. Given these are intraday trend trades, it's almost incomprehensible to me. My style is intraday trend trading, and with the 3 to 5 to 1 or sometimes higher reward/risk profiles I'm happy anywhere in the 30% to 50% winners range.

I have a few more questions. Is there a way to follow along and see live trade signals the moment they develop, on a trial basis? The web site mentions visiting a live webinar for a day. Would one see live signals in time to act, or only after they have started? What if no signals are generated that day, can someone try another day? It's very hard to evaluate a system with a one-day trial, especially one that generates only a few signals.

Next, what is the difference between live webinars and live trading room, as far as signals given in real-time? Also, if one signs on to your room and gets all that training, does that do any good without the software? What is the cost of the license, since the website doesn't specify this? I'd love to follow along real-time for a period and evaluate your system, but I'm not sure you have any provisions where I could do that without laying out money first. Again, if I don't ask all these questions, someone else will. Since I'm probably the longest-winded character at this forum, I figured I'd just get the ball rolling. It's not often I hear about a system that has almost no losers at all.

Lastly, if we go much further with this discussion it may be appropriate to move it from this thread to one you or someone else could create in Trading Advisory Services.

Originally posted by Maestro

Rich finally called. He spent about an hour with me. I apologize for the disparaging remark. Everything I stated re. my experience with viper is accurate however.

I find it pathetic that Rich only took it upon himself to call you after he read your post here.

And I don't think anything in your post is personally disparigng in any way whatsoever.

Thanks for being honest about your experience. Hopefully others will benefit from it.

I think I understand why Viper is canning the RusselViperAT. It is a huge account killer. This week, it went to Big Red (-$800) 3 days. Today, it took less than an hour to lose $800.

Released in November, it is now in a death spiral like the other Viper AT that were prematurely sold to the public without any verifiable track record or backtesting. I scratch my head wondering why people would pay for this stuff.

Mark my words, this latest incarnation of Viper--Scalper--will go down the same path as the others, leaving its users a whole lot poorer than they were before they drank the Viper Kool-aid.

Over the years, having seen guys like these come and go after wrecking people's accounts, I have come to realization that their victims deserve exactly what they get. I'm sure many will think that I'm heartless and without compassion for my fellow traders....but, come on, if they don't do their due diligence then they will never be successful as traders.

Anyone, who thinks someone is going to sell them an automatically running profitable system for a few hundred dollars needs their head examined. And, they would be better off taking their money and throwing it out the window....at least then they would know where it went.

Or, better yet, if you want to lose your money, just send it to a another trader directly-no reason to pay a commission on either side or spend time in front of the screen and your results will be the same.

Today's results for the ViperScalper AT in a few instruments. The parameters were set according to the "guidance" Rich gave in yesterday's webinar.

Perhaps the principals of Viper think customers will feel less pain if they lose their money in smaller bundles in multiple markets rather than one big loss in a single hour.

How about using opposite signals? Buy when the signals says Sell. Sell when the signal says Buy. :-)

Originally posted by stocksster

How about using opposite signals? Buy when the signals says Sell. Sell when the signal says Buy. :-)

Viper Emini Auto Fader.

I was just informed someone started a ViperTradingSystem group at Yahoo. Be interesting to see any different responses over there.

Jack

Originally posted by jgreene

I was just informed someone started a ViperTradingSystem group at Yahoo. Be interesting to see any different responses over there.

Jack

This is the group description at yahoo groups:


Chat Room for all E-Mini Equities, Futures and Currency day traders utilizing the Viper Trading Systems and Emini Auto Trader from www.vipertradingsystems.com and www.eminiautotrader.com. Discuss system caveats, performance and hybrid strategies you are using to help increase win ration. Exchange ideas on getting the most out of these systems. Post questions & comments.

This group is for serious traders using Viper and Emini Auto systems. If you wish to post negative comments, please use mypivots or bigmikestrading

Originally posted by bubbles

Originally posted by jgreene

I was just informed someone started a ViperTradingSystem group at Yahoo. Be interesting to see any different responses over there.

Jack

This is the group description at yahoo groups:


Chat Room for all E-Mini Equities, Futures and Currency day traders utilizing the Viper Trading Systems and Emini Auto Trader from www.vipertradingsystems.com and www.eminiautotrader.com. Discuss system caveats, performance and hybrid strategies you are using to help increase win ration. Exchange ideas on getting the most out of these systems. Post questions & comments.

This group is for serious traders using Viper and Emini Auto systems. If you wish to post negative comments, please use mypivots or bigmikestrading

If users are not making any money with these scripts, they shouldn't post their experiences on Yahoo? Why the hell not, bubbles?

So, it's a place to drink the Viper Kool-aid and have pep rallies where a load of Viper shills can post glorious lies on the merits of this garbage with impunity or fear of challenge. If that's the case, tell Charlie and Co. to simply resucitate the Viper forum that was on their website. This way, it can be a private Viper lovefest.

The yahoo group description means that there won't be any useful comments. Everyone that uses their autotrader systems loses money overall, so what could they post? They could say they had a great day and not mention all of the losing days. Maybe they could talk about reloaded charts or drawing on charts from days ago.

To be honest, if the viper guys weren't so controlling I'd probably have more profits by learning from other members. But since the chat room and webinars aren't chat rooms or webinars it was extremely disapointing. It's so one sided. Obviously, in chat rooms, people chat and you can see what they are saying, in webinars everyone should be able to see everyone's comments and questions. They say that GoToMeeting doesn't support that, I'm not sure about that, but if it doesn't then use something else to appear more genuine.

Phantasmagoria, did you happen to catch the webinar on Feb. 6? In the first couple of minutes, some guy named Rick on a microphone asked Charles a question on false breakouts. I had to laugh because Charles immediately lost his microphone(faked it probably) and Gary had to try to explain how to use the manual viper and not take the false breakouts, which is impossible live, but easy on an old chart. After Gary was done Charles magically reappeared, classic Charles. I recorded it and have the clip, I could post it somewhere, or maybe it's copyrighted, but I don't think so.

Sorry this reply is 2-years late but I just joined the forum.

I know from personal experience that GoToMeeting and GoToWebinar default to showing all users and all comments unless specifically disabled by the Host.

If they're saying what was reported that's a blatant lie.