My reply To Jim Kane

I have no intention of making a "personal" response and since someone has blocked the ability to use the reply button to your recent post this is the only way I know to reach you. I want to keep this as public as possible and deep down so do you. Our emails in the past have left me with empty promises, I still have emails were you tell me that taking down your site is going to be a slow process. Well, here it is 4 - 5 years later and your still selling stuff from that same site ( it's never been taken down) and I would assume you are still mentoring "private" clients. Your favorite way of teaching. So I guess it really has been a slow process You also never posted the public charts you said you would and I find it funny that you just want to gloss over that. And now your expecting something from me ? How strange ! I found that last post full of ego and arrogance. You should also go back and actually read the fib grid as it has no mention of decimal places or fractions and doesn't use highs or lows to calculate fibonacci lines. That's because they are not fibonacci lines. . That title was just my way of being a wise ass ( people are fibbing if they try to sell you stuff about fibs)as I have never heard of anyone using fibs to make money on a consistent basis. As far as Gann goes you can read what Larry Williams found out about Gann when he met his son and a guy who worked for him. Pure fluff but people still buy into it.

So it doesn't take a genius to realize ahead of time that I am not about to give up my time to validate you JIm. You are getting caught up on wanting to get credit for a number. Some .88 decimal thing or something. Lets have you validate yourself to us. Just scan in 4 years of verified trading statements. You will then have the honor of being one of the one percent ( not even sure if it would be that high )of people selling trading information that can actually back up their claims. Or just take some white out and get rid of your account stuff, scan them in and then all the world can see. You will have the validation you seem to be looking for.They can be quarterly or whatever you want. You obviously have tons of time if you are the one with the most posts and can write so much . So this should be a small task.

I have absolutely no interest in your material. So lets not drag this on and have you keep us waiting for years to get us those statements. You know that I am always suspicious of posts from people that need to keep their name out there. That's a given. It doesn't take a genius to know I would think that.

Let's not insult the forum anymore with this. Just post the statements and put and end to it. Anything less just implies that you are stalling and trying to redirect peoples attention. Oh yeah, one last thing .."wealthy" is a relative term so don't get so hung up on that.

Bruce

I have to be honest, I have no idea what the heck is going on here. If I tell you I am going bowling Friday, and then my aunt gets sick and I have to take her to the emergency room, that makes me a liar? My credibility as a man is suspect? I said I planned to take the website down, but it was a slow process. I changed my mind. That makes me a liar? No matter what a person says, they have no leeway to ever change their mind, or that makes them a liar? I have never heard a single human being in my entire life say that's their belief system.

Okay, this only applies to vendors? Vendors have a higher standard? They must do everything they say to the letter, no matter the circumstances, or the credibility of the man who owns the vendor business is shot? Does that make sense to anyone but Bruce? This was all about me wanting to show Bruce I make market turn calls all the time. Now it's only about how as a man my credibility is shot with him because I'm a big fat liar because I changed my mind on something I said I planned to do? I'm in the frickin' twilight zone, this just can't be happening...

Yes that is really painful, if you publish in open forum, and to access the one lead by Jim one needs to buy his books, but still he is much more recognized here...

Originally posted by MarcinO

What you want to do is to simply put down Jim and his work. I wonder why?
Is it because he has a steady group of regular followers and leads the most active forum on the whole mypivots site?

Let's call it quit. We are close to the point, where 2+2=4 will be questioned...

Originally posted by jimkane

I have to be honest, I have no idea what the heck is going on here. If I tell you I am going bowling Friday, and then my aunt gets sick and I have to take her to the emergency room, that makes me a liar? My credibility as a man is suspect? I said I planned to take the website down, but it was a slow process. I changed my mind. That makes me a liar? No matter what a person says, they have no leeway to ever change their mind, or that makes them a liar? I have never heard a single human being in my entire life say that's their belief system.

Okay, this only applies to vendors? Vendors have a higher standard? They must do everything they say to the letter, no matter the circumstances, or the credibility of the man who owns the vendor business is shot? Does that make sense to anyone but Bruce? This was all about me wanting to show Bruce I make market turn calls all the time. Now it's only about how as a man my credibility is shot with him because I'm a big fat liar because I changed my mind on something I said I planned to do? I'm in the frickin' twilight zone, this just can't be happening...

let me ask you a simple question:
you tell two contractors to show up to give you bids on an addition to your home.......one shows up on time as promised this is contractor A ....the other shows up 4- 5 hours late and never calls and has some excuses going on ..this is contractor B....both give the same price for the job......................are you more likely to hire contractor A or B given this information provided ?

just a simple answer A or B ??

Originally posted by MarcinO

I read everything au nd decided to focus on one aspect showing absolute lack of logic in your posts. If I were to address all remaining ones I would have to take a day or two off.

Originally posted by BruceM

a person who doesn't keep to their word cannot be trusted as much as someone who does......you can bend and twist that however you like....u need to get up to speed and read all the history....your coming in shooting from the hip without all the facts..........so if you want to be logical you need to understand the entire story ...not just the part that helps your agenda....get with it and then ramble on....these bits and pieces are nothing........go back and read up on all this IF you really care.

]Originally posted by MarcinO[/i]

So vendor who at some point decided to close his website, the only means of communication with potential new students, and for soem reason changed his mind, is less reliable than the one who closed his business?

no, judging him as a vendor on a trading website who doesn't keep to his word.....that is not professional....

I will do that as soon as you answer all my questions you ignored calling them irrelevant. Can't wait to see it.
And one more question by Jim. If his decision to close or not his website was to assess his credibility as a vendor, not a trader (and this is what you wrote), why did you ask for his statements? One can be a great educator but cannot trade himself for various reasons...
Thank you in advance! Good night!

Originally posted by BruceM

let me ask you a simple question:
you tell two contractors to show up to give you bids on an addition to your home.......one shows up on time as promised this is contractor A ....the other shows up 4- 5 hours late and never calls and has some excuses going on ..this is contractor B....both give the same price for the job......................are you more likely to hire contractor A or B given this information provided ?

just a simple answer A or B ??

Originally posted by MarcinO

I read everything au nd decided to focus on one aspect showing absolute lack of logic in your posts. If I were to address all remaining ones I would have to take a day or two off.

Originally posted by BruceM

a person who doesn't keep to their word cannot be trusted as much as someone who does......you can bend and twist that however you like....u need to get up to speed and read all the history....your coming in shooting from the hip without all the facts..........so if you want to be logical you need to understand the entire story ...not just the part that helps your agenda....get with it and then ramble on....these bits and pieces are nothing........go back and read up on all this IF you really care.

]Originally posted by MarcinO[/i]

So vendor who at some point decided to close his website, the only means of communication with potential new students, and for soem reason changed his mind, is less reliable than the one who closed his business?

no, judging him as a vendor on a trading website who doesn't keep to his word.....that is not professional....

yeah ...u gotta know when your emotions are ruling out over logic and you keep going off course......but keep at it.....the logic will come to you after your devotion to JIm K is put aside

So you are talking about logic?
I am not a native speaker of English, but I guess this is what you call an oxymoron.

Originally posted by BruceM

yeah ...u gotta know when your emotions are ruling out over logic and you keep going off course......but keep at it.....the logic will come to you after your devotion to JIm K is put aside

I guess I will have to go back to the archive and see and post what led up to this. Here's what Bruce posted in this thread:

"Jim Kane :"
Bottom line is, I have been phasing it out, it’s been in progress, but cutting the final cord, thinking about looking up and saying to my dad, here it goes, dad, I’m doing it to you again, I don’t care about this project, I don’t care that we did this together, Bruce has really made me see it’s time, well, that is something I just can’t make myself do yet. "

so you stated to me that you were phasing out the site but haven't finished the entire task yet ! I understand that it was a painful situation but this is exactly what you said.


First off, does anyone see a time in here where I stated when the final phase would happen? So, the issue for Bruce is I am not doing this as fast as he thinks I should have, so that makes me a liar? Someone who doesn't do what they promised? And notice in this quote he seems so fond of, I am talking to my dad, looking up to heaven, and telling him how Bruce has made me see the light. Hallelujah. Now seriously, he can't see the way that is phrased, almost as a sarcastic respond to his pressure for me to shut it down? Like Bruce showed me the light, he showed me the error of my ways trying to help people and make a profit that way. How disgusting that is.

How did I conclude that quote? "...well, that is something I just can’t make myself do yet." Did I then say when I might? Did I ever say I'd get up what it takes to finally do it? I can't see that anywhere in there. I see no promises in that quote at all. It talks about my intentions, not my promises. If someone says at the end of a trading day "I'll see ya all in the morning" and they don't show up, are they a liar? Have they lost their credibility as a man? If I scour every post in the entire forum will I find one thing Bruce said he'd do that he didn't, irregardless of circumstances? If so, should he lose all his credibility as a man?

And, since Bruce is such a firm believer in God, isn't it a saying, let he who is without sin cast the first stone? Can you tell me, honestly Bruce, here and now before the forum and God that in the last month for example, you told not one single white lie of any kind? Not the tiniest little one to anyone? Every word you said was 100% truth? Because if you say you did, then I guess you have no credibility as a man, either. And if you say no, well, too funny. As God says, all men are sinners. And this isn't even relevant, because nothing about what I said was a lie.

Originally posted by BruceM

a person who doesn't keep to their word cannot be trusted as much as someone who does......you can bend and twist that however you like....u need to get up to speed and read all the history....your coming in shooting from the hip without all the facts..........so if you want to be logical you need to understand the entire story ...not just the part that helps your agenda....get with it and then ramble on....these bits and pieces are nothing........go back and read up on all this IF you really care.

And here we go now trying to shown this guy is some kind of mindless cult follower of me. All the tricks, they just keep coming out.

Originally posted by BruceM

yeah ...u gotta know when your emotions are ruling out over logic and you keep going off course......but keep at it.....the logic will come to you after your devotion to JIm K is put aside

I think this should put this whole thing to rest. I plan to lock this thread soon because this all has to stop. In trading one of my most famous sayings is “Without ‘context’, you have nothing.” I think I could also mention a few other sayings before I start. 'Those facts, they are a b%#$&', and 'Context, it can be a real b%#$&'.

Let’s look at the quote Bruce is endlessly bringing up, the one he says shows I’m a liar, and lack any credibility for not doing what I say. There were multiple pages telling, in the usual Jim Kane fashion (endlessly long and wordy), the entire story with my dad before what you see here. I then went on here to summarize it a bit. In here is the quote Bruce cut and pasted, with no context. Read this, and then we’ll look at Bruce’s response. I will highlight in red what he posted in this thread, his reason for saying I’m a liar and have lost all credibility as a man in his eyes.


jimkane wrote on 17-Mar-11 6:50:10 PM EST:

This whole website and book thing was ‘our’ project, the thing my dad and I shared until he died. The only link I feel I have left with him. He created the website, he did the book covers. I’ll never forget the look on his face when I told him to dump the old website he put so much in to. Now, I’m going to dump all this. I have been planning and working on it for awhile. You don’t follow the website, so you don’t know the facts. I was writing the commentary daily. Then I went to twice weekly. Then I went to weekly. Then I went to monthly. Then I went to no commentary. I used to run a members service, then I dropped it. I used to sell the books separately, many trips to the post office, but that was more than I wanted to do, so I went to full sets only. My sales dropped off a cliff. Nowadays I have gone as long as four months without a sale. I used to have people come to me in person to mentor. About two years ago I went to remote only. But since I have essentially zero human contact and rarely leave the house at all, that was a good thing for me. Now I only do remote. How many students? I might do two a year. And since many students want to keep working with me, one for six years now, I can’t take on a new one unless one drops out. So, I haven’t added a new student for I can’t recall, well over a year? Wow, some vendor business.

Bottom line is, I have been phasing it out, it’s been in progress, but cutting the final cord, thinking about looking up and saying to my dad, here it goes, dad, I’m doing it to you again, I don’t care about this project, I don’t care that we did this together, Bruce has really made me see it’s time, well, that is something I just can’t make myself do yet. When my dad died he was wearing a T-shirt my better half and I picked out for him from up here. I asked the funeral home what he was wearing. I asked that they save his clothes, as I wanted to keep that. When I got his ashes, the guy gave me a bag with the clothes in it. It has been in that bag, in the same exact spot in my closet, since 2006. Every year I say I will open it, wash the shirt and hang it in the closet. It is coming up on five years and I can’t do it. I don’t know if I ever will be able to. A piece of my chest was ripped out that day, and I doubt I’ll ever remotely recover from it. And you want to push me into taking down my website, goading me, trying to make it seem like I have an ulterior motive, my true motives being I’m really a vendor in disguise. I’m not a vendor, I’m a guy who did a project with his dad who thought he might be able to help some people, and the project took on a life of its own. And now, for personal reasons, it’s hard for me to take the final step. That’s all.


BruceM wrote on 22-Mar-11 9:54:59 PM EST:

Hi Jim,

We did "speak" about your dad and your moving nightmare when we last communicated through email and I actually "get it". I completely understand where you are coming from.......that website sounds as if it was an intense experience on many levels and a real bonding process for you and your dad. That would be hard to let go of so I see why you have been hesitant to break away from it. That makes sense to me. Thanks for explaining that in detail. It actually drove home the point to me so lets leave that at that.


Okay,

A) I don’t quite see where I ‘promised’ Bruce I was taking it down. It seems as though I described where I was at at the time, in an open and honest manner.

B) It seems as though Bruce totally understood that, and was fine with it.


Now seriously, folks, how does the above exchange translate into I’m a liar and have no credibility with Bruce, especially as a vendor, because I didn’t do what I ‘promised’ him. Those facts and context truly are a b%#$&. Now, I’m begging everyone in the name of all that’s holy, can we please stop this? Please?

This is my forum in here, no matter who starts the thread. I closed this topic. Posting after that is showing no respect. The only reason it isn't already locked is there were some forum changes and moderators can't lock it right now, so we are waiting on Guy. Please stop posting. If you want to continue this discussion go outside the Kane Trading forum area and start a new thread out there.